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    Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

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    thatguyfromderby

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by thatguyfromderby on Wed 01 Jun 2016, 8:40 pm

    I'd personally keep him. But I guess it's a good chunk of money :)
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    MadAmster

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by MadAmster on Wed 01 Jun 2016, 9:10 pm

    He is and can be a match winner but his score on the givafuqedness-o-meter is all too often in the minus column for him to be a decisive factor in a promotion push.

    Sell him for £6M and we won't have to sell Hughes although I doubt we need to sell Will even if we don't sell Ince.



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    Boris

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by Boris on Wed 01 Jun 2016, 9:20 pm

    thatguyfromderby wrote:I'd personally keep him. But I guess it's a good chunk of money :)

    Think Pearson will get the best out of him...keep....
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    Loughborough Ram

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by Loughborough Ram on Wed 01 Jun 2016, 9:40 pm

    Taking £6m off West Ham IS getting the best out of him
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    ShardlowSheep

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by ShardlowSheep on Wed 01 Jun 2016, 10:06 pm

    6 million for Ince would certainly be tempting.  I suspect we could get someone with more consistency for that amount of money.
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    Loughborough Ram

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by Loughborough Ram on Wed 01 Jun 2016, 10:09 pm

    He consistent Shards, consistently disinterested.
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    outsider

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by outsider on Thu 02 Jun 2016, 6:09 am

    Loughborough Ram wrote:He consistent Shards, consistently disinterested.

    For a disinterested player , he is second on the motm league voted by us lot on this forum ..... 2nd top goal scorer with 12 goals
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    Boris

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by Boris on Thu 02 Jun 2016, 6:57 am

    outsider wrote:
    Loughborough Ram wrote:He consistent Shards, consistently disinterested.

    For a disinterested player , he is second on the motm league voted by us lot on this forum ..... 2nd top goal scorer with  12 goals

    and second in the assists....he could score 30 goals a season and still not convince some on here..when your face doesn't fit.... COYR
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    Loughborough Ram

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by Loughborough Ram on Thu 02 Jun 2016, 6:58 am

    Just imagine how good he could be if he tried
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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by MadAmster on Thu 02 Jun 2016, 7:15 am

    His productivity is similar to that of JR. Same number of assists and he scored 1 or 2 goals more. The difference is that JR does it with about half the natural skill and potential of Tom. JR also tracks back, tackles and works like a demon.

    On the whole JR is far more valuable than Tom.

    I think Tom's biggest PR problem is that he knows and we know what he CAN do. It's just that he only does what he is capable of in, I would estimate, 20% of the games he plays. A top 6 PL side might be able to accommodate such an enigma. We can't.




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    bramhallram

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by bramhallram on Thu 02 Jun 2016, 8:57 am


    I don't see a place for Ince in the brave new world of DCFC under Pearson. If we can offload him to a PL club for £6m I'd say it was a good deal for all parties.

    .
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    CornwallRam

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by CornwallRam on Thu 02 Jun 2016, 10:12 am

    Loughborough Ram wrote:Just imagine how good he could be if he tried

    Indeed - I hope that we don't sell him because I'd like to see what Pearson can make of him. Imagine how good Ince could be if put 100% effort in and had a clearly defined role in the team. I think that Pearson will either make or break him - it would be a shame for the two never to actually work together.
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    Boris

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by Boris on Thu 02 Jun 2016, 10:22 am

    CornwallRam wrote:
    Loughborough Ram wrote:Just imagine how good he could be if he tried

    Indeed - I hope that we don't sell him because I'd like to see what Pearson can make of him. Imagine how good Ince could be if put 100% effort in and had a clearly defined role in the team. I think that Pearson will either make or break him - it would be a shame for the two never to actually work together.

    Do people seriously think Ince walks out on the pitch and decides he isn't going to try Flogging dead horse
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    CornwallRam

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by CornwallRam on Thu 02 Jun 2016, 10:40 am

    Boris wrote:
    CornwallRam wrote:
    Loughborough Ram wrote:Just imagine how good he could be if he tried

    Indeed - I hope that we don't sell him because I'd like to see what Pearson can make of him. Imagine how good Ince could be if put 100% effort in and had a clearly defined role in the team. I think that Pearson will either make or break him - it would be a shame for the two never to actually work together.

    Do people seriously think Ince walks out on the pitch and decides he isn't going to try Flogging dead horse

    No, but I do think he sees a loose ball during a game and thinks that it's not his job to risk injury contesting it with the oncoming full back. I think he sees Scott Carson gather in the ball and look up for a fast breakaway, but thinks that it would expend too much energy to sprint flat out to create the opening. I think he believes that he will lose any aerial contests, so doesn't bother trying. He appears to be attempting to conserve himself so he's ready should an opportunity to be creative show itself - and when it doesn't he's a passenger.

    I remember watching David Beckham play live and being amazed by his sheer effort. He ran and ran, and despite not being the best tackler in the world, never missed an opportunity to contest the ball. Ince may well have more talent than Beckham did, but he appears to have a mind set that believes that his job is the creative stuff, not the hard work. I'm sure he believes that he is trying - but if he actually worked hard as well he'd contribute to every game, not his current one in five.


    Last edited by CornwallRam on Thu 02 Jun 2016, 10:53 am; edited 1 time in total
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    rob

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by rob on Thu 02 Jun 2016, 10:50 am

    would rather keep ince than butterfield or johnson
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    MadAmster

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by MadAmster on Thu 02 Jun 2016, 11:00 am

    rob wrote:would rather keep ince than butterfield or johnson

    Easy solution..... sell all 3.



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    thatguyfromderby

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by thatguyfromderby on Thu 02 Jun 2016, 4:16 pm

    But 23 goals for a season and a half isn't a bad return. A tough call for Pearson methinks.
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    valakari

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by valakari on Thu 02 Jun 2016, 4:47 pm

    Ince could be sold at a profit...I doubt the same could be said for Johnson and Butterfield...this is a problem for FFP...we need to sell players at a profit, so, as much as I rate Ince, if we get offered £6m, I would take it and buy de Laet and Hanley.
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    rob

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by rob on Thu 02 Jun 2016, 5:09 pm

    assuming we have them on 4 year contracts we can take 1m on butterfield and 1.5m on Johnson (still a problem I know) and it have no negative impact on FFP
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    Boris

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by Boris on Thu 02 Jun 2016, 5:23 pm

    thatguyfromderby wrote:But 23 goals for a season and a half isn't a bad return. A tough call for Pearson methinks.

    Indeed...
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    CornwallRam

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by CornwallRam on Thu 02 Jun 2016, 6:05 pm

    rob wrote:assuming we have them on 4 year contracts we can take 1m on butterfield and 1.5m on Johnson (still a problem I know) and it have no negative impact on FFP

    That's not so sadly Rob. The transfer fee has to settle the amortisation liability to avoid becoming an FFP loss.

    Both were signed on four year contracts. Assuming that reported fees of £6m for Johnson and £4m for Butterfield were accurate, we'd need £4.5m for Johnson and £3m for Butterfield. Anything over £3.56m for Ince and we're in profit.
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    rob

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by rob on Fri 03 Jun 2016, 7:42 am

    mate I meant that what the hit was not what we should sell them for - I did get an o level in maths a long long long long time ago :-)
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    MadAmster

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by MadAmster on Fri 03 Jun 2016, 9:30 am

    thatguyfromderby wrote:But 23 goals for a season and a half isn't a bad return. A tough call for Pearson methinks.

    True, but it's more than just that. Roughly half of those came in the 2nd half of the 14/15 season but we lost most of the games we played over that period. It's more about the return you get from his efforts. If you had a striker who scored 2 goals every game but you lost every game 3-2, would you keep him or would you sell him and buy a new defence?

    Ince can be a joy to watch. He can be a match winner. But how often? Nowhere near enough IMO.

    If Pearson thinks he can get Ince performing in 75% of the matches instead of 25% then we should keep him, otherwise, get rid.



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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by New England Ram on Fri 03 Jun 2016, 10:47 am

    Powell was Butterfields manager at Huddersfield when the kid was playing well...hopefully he knows how to get the best out of him.



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    Boris

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    Re: Derby transfer rumours - Summer 2016

    Post by Boris on Fri 03 Jun 2016, 11:15 am

    MadAmster wrote:
    thatguyfromderby wrote:But 23 goals for a season and a half isn't a bad return. A tough call for Pearson methinks.

    True, but it's more than just that. Roughly half of those came in the 2nd half of the 14/15 season but we lost most of the games we played over that period. It's more about the return you get from his efforts. If you had a striker who scored 2 goals every game but you lost every game 3-2, would you keep him or would you sell him and buy a new defence?

    Ince can be a joy to watch. He can be a match winner. But how often? Nowhere near enough IMO.

    If Pearson thinks he can get Ince performing in 75% of the matches instead of 25% then we should keep him, otherwise, get rid.

    What strange logic....yes, maybe strengthen the defence but keep the striker scoring the goals....

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