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    kooklaRam

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    sack them all

    Post by kooklaRam on Tue 14 Feb 2017, 9:38 pm

    They can all go
    Mclaren,Powell and Phillips
    none of them are up to the job,go and get Rowett before someone else steps in
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    chicken
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    Re: sack them all

    Post by chicken on Tue 14 Feb 2017, 9:58 pm

    Sounds good to me!
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    mcsilks

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by mcsilks on Tue 14 Feb 2017, 10:11 pm

    Well, I never wanted McClaren, even first time around. An absolute joke of a manager with a truly awful record.

    I never wanted Powell. Again, a joke of a manager with a truly awful record.

    As for Kevin Phillips. The first thing Ranieri did was to rid Leicester of this man. You have to ask yourself why. What happened to them as soon as he departed...

    Although the thread was maybe started as a tongue in cheek backlash after another on the pitch debacle, I think there is a genuine need to as the op suggests, 'sack them all'.
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    purpleram

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by purpleram on Tue 14 Feb 2017, 10:14 pm

    Sometimes it hurts to be proved right (I know I wasn't the only one) but I will be glad to see the back of Mac
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    kooklaRam

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by kooklaRam on Tue 14 Feb 2017, 10:28 pm

    No tongue in cheek mcsilks if anything I have been biting it for a few weeks but enough is now enough.

    2 failed  managers and a striker coach that has failed to get the best out of how many forwards we have on our books.

    All 3  need to go and go by the end of the week
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    CornwallRam

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by CornwallRam on Tue 14 Feb 2017, 10:36 pm

    Unfair on Chris Powell - his record as a manager is actually pretty decent.

    As for McClaren, the sooner he's gone the better. He may well be a decent coach but he was lucky that he inherited a talented and balanced squad from Nigel Clough. He's failed to improve that squad and is clueless as to what to do now it needs rebuilding.

    Interesting to hear lots of Derby fans talking about Rowett and Warburton on the way out.
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    Mitten State Ram

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by Mitten State Ram on Tue 14 Feb 2017, 10:38 pm

    I remain on the fence about Stevie Mac, but I was certainly serious in my comment in the chat box following the Cardiff winner. Since the playoff final in 2013 virtually every player acquisition with the exception of Tom Ince has made our squad worse. I would amend the thread title to "sell 'em all". The ones we can't sell we should just shoot.

    Serious, name the players we've added to the squad since then that you would go out and buy again if they were suddenly not on contract with Derby.

    Ince, Shackell (though we don't even play him), maybe Johnson but not for 6 Mil. That's it for me. we spend and spend and get worse and worse.



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    CornwallRam

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by CornwallRam on Tue 14 Feb 2017, 11:04 pm

    Mitten State Ram wrote:I remain on the fence about Stevie Mac, but I was certainly serious in my comment in the chat box following the Cardiff winner. Since the playoff final in 2013 virtually every player acquisition with the exception of Tom Ince has made our squad worse. I would amend the thread title to "sell 'em all". The ones we can't sell we should just shoot.

    Serious, name the players we've added to the squad since then that you would go out and buy again if they were suddenly not on contract with Derby.

    Ince, Shackell (though we don't even play him), maybe Johnson but not for 6 Mil. That's it for me. we spend and spend and get worse and worse.

    Ibe was excellent for his last month with us. Ince maybe, but only when he's in the mood. Anya is a decent player but needs a target man to cross to. Pearce has improved us. Vydra is an excellent player but McJudas doesn't play a system that he fits into. Carson is better than Grant.

    De Sart is not at the level of Thorne, but shows some signs being a good acquisition. Baird has had his ups and downs, but overall has done OK. Mitchell has a decent reputation, but I've not seen enough of him in proper matces to properly guage.

    Not Shackell - just too slow on the ball. Johnson hasn't added anything. Crabby McButterfield is not very good. Olsson is a downgrade on Forsyth, as was Warnock. Nugent, Bent and Weimann don't fit Tufty's system. Mascarell was poor. Camara is just an expensive version of Theo Robinson. Lingard was rubbish for us. Roos was at least cheap, but hasn't developed. We also signed a load of U21 players last time the Toon fanboy and Chris Evans were here - most of whom have since left. There were a few others who drifted around like Mendy and that really slow aging left back whose name escapes me, that didn't add anything.

    When you consider the cash spent, our recruitment has been shocking since Wembley.
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    outsider

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by outsider on Tue 14 Feb 2017, 11:35 pm

    As / was a fan of SMC but I have lost all faith . Wtf is going on at derby. Play offs my arse. Really pi55ed of with players manager and board... Really don't know where we go from here.
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    Jackal

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by Jackal on Tue 14 Feb 2017, 11:42 pm

    CornwallRam wrote:
    Mitten State Ram wrote:I remain on the fence about Stevie Mac, but I was certainly serious in my comment in the chat box following the Cardiff winner. Since the playoff final in 2013 virtually every player acquisition with the exception of Tom Ince has made our squad worse. I would amend the thread title to "sell 'em all". The ones we can't sell we should just shoot.

    Serious, name the players we've added to the squad since then that you would go out and buy again if they were suddenly not on contract with Derby.

    Ince, Shackell (though we don't even play him), maybe Johnson but not for 6 Mil. That's it for me. we spend and spend and get worse and worse.

    Ibe was excellent for his last month with us. Ince maybe, but only when he's in the mood. Anya is a decent player but needs a target man to cross to. Pearce has improved us. Vydra is an excellent player but McJudas doesn't play a system that he fits into. Carson is better than Grant.

    De Sart is not at the level of Thorne, but shows some signs being a good acquisition. Baird has had his ups and downs, but overall has done OK. Mitchell has a decent reputation, but I've not seen enough of him in proper matces to properly guage.

    Not Shackell - just too slow on the ball. Johnson hasn't added anything. Crabby McButterfield is not very good. Olsson is a downgrade on Forsyth, as was Warnock. Nugent, Bent and Weimann don't fit Tufty's system. Mascarell was poor. Camara is just an expensive version of Theo Robinson. Lingard was rubbish for us. Roos was at least cheap, but hasn't developed. We also signed a load of U21 players last time the Toon fanboy and Chris Evans were here - most of whom have since left. There were a few others who drifted around like Mendy and that really slow aging left back whose name escapes me, that didn't add anything.

    When you consider the cash spent, our recruitment has been shocking since Wembley.
    Lee Naylor?
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    Mitten State Ram

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by Mitten State Ram on Wed 15 Feb 2017, 12:16 am

    Carson for sure. One upgrade in a position that is more needful than ever thanks to the play of our "upgrades" elsewhere.



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    Mitten State Ram

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by Mitten State Ram on Wed 15 Feb 2017, 12:25 am

    outsider wrote:As / was a fan of SMC but I have lost all faith . Wtf is going on at derby. Play offs my arse. Really pi55ed of with players manager and board... Really don't know where we go from here.

    Basically our only hope is that McClaren's plan to put the old band back together for another run next year succeeds. I don't think it will, and any hope that it can depends upon perfect health of our starters all year because the backups are useless. When does any club get that? But we do still have a starting 11 theoretically available for next season that can win together in this division in the gaffer's benighted one-and-only system.

                                         
    Carson

     
    Christie      Keogh/Shackell    Baird/Pearce     Forsythe
                                       
                                      Thorne (De Sarte)

                                  Hughes           Bryson (Johnson)

                                    Vydra                           Ince
                                          Martin (Nugent)        

    Derby can win with this team. But it's no more than two probably only ever one injury to one of half a dozen players away from falling into total ineptitude. Long-term I'm afraid it doesn't look good for us. Three years from now we'll be languishing without Hughes and only the worst of these players amounting to an incoherent squad being paid wages they don't deserve and Mel will tire of paying. Then what? Bugger knows.



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    MadAmster

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by MadAmster on Wed 15 Feb 2017, 6:44 am

    Player comparison.....

    Bent has 12 goals so far so has a chance to hit the 20 benchmark Coldplay laid down. Nowhere near as good in the assists department though.

    JR isn't as good as JR was
    Bryson isn't as good as Bryson was
    BJ isn't as good as BJ was
    Hughes isn't as good as Hughes was but that IMO is not down to a lack of fitness (speed, agility and stamina) but a lack of wellness (that heavily strapped leg is hampering him)

    Olsson isn't as good as Forsyth (or as good as Lowe for that matter, if Lowe is fit)

    Carson is better than Grant


    The defence has been a rock all season. In the top 3 of the meanest defences for much of the season....... and now 7 goals against in 2 games against strugglers. Cause? IMO the old inability to deal with dead ball situations and..... in the last 2 games we have had less cover for the back 4 with, for instance, de Sart last night playing further forward than BJ has been.

    People always talk about positives after defeats. The positive from the last 2 games is that we twice scored 3 goals so we are doing reasonably well going forward. We should do it more often and more often at speed. Defensively we have become a colander and that is what needs mending....... QUICKLY!






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    norfolkram

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by norfolkram on Wed 15 Feb 2017, 8:04 am

    Steve Mcclaren ooh ooh ooh, Steve Mcclaren ooh ooh ooh, Steve MccLaren and Powell must go oh oh.
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    purpleram

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by purpleram on Wed 15 Feb 2017, 8:50 am

    I don't think it's that the players aren't good enough, they can beat anyone on their day.

    Look at Derby v Hull last season as proof in the pudding. Regularly out-played Hull, actually beat up on them a bit, until it mattered and the lack of bottle, character whatever it is reared it's head.

    This team, and this manager are mentally weak, whether it can be changed by signing a Hindmarchesq character I don't know, but as the squad/manager stands we will never amount to a hill of beans.
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    Angus1

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by Angus1 on Wed 15 Feb 2017, 8:57 am

    CornwallRam wrote:
    Mitten State Ram wrote:I remain on the fence about Stevie Mac, but I was certainly serious in my comment in the chat box following the Cardiff winner. Since the playoff final in 2013 virtually every player acquisition with the exception of Tom Ince has made our squad worse. I would amend the thread title to "sell 'em all". The ones we can't sell we should just shoot.

    Serious, name the players we've added to the squad since then that you would go out and buy again if they were suddenly not on contract with Derby.

    Ince, Shackell (though we don't even play him), maybe Johnson but not for 6 Mil. That's it for me. we spend and spend and get worse and worse.

    Ibe was excellent for his last month with us. Ince maybe, but only when he's in the mood. Anya is a decent player but needs a target man to cross to. Pearce has improved us. Vydra is an excellent player but McJudas doesn't play a system that he fits into. Carson is better than Grant.

    De Sart is not at the level of Thorne, but shows some signs being a good acquisition. Baird has had his ups and downs, but overall has done OK. Mitchell has a decent reputation, but I've not seen enough of him in proper matces to properly guage.

    Not Shackell - just too slow on the ball. Johnson hasn't added anything. Crabby McButterfield is not very good. Olsson is a downgrade on Forsyth, as was Warnock. Nugent, Bent and Weimann don't fit Tufty's system. Mascarell was poor. Camara is just an expensive version of Theo Robinson. Lingard was rubbish for us. Roos was at least cheap, but hasn't developed. We also signed a load of U21 players last time the Toon fanboy and Chris Evans were here - most of whom have since left. There were a few others who drifted around like Mendy and that really slow aging left back whose name escapes me, that didn't add anything.

    When you consider the cash spent, our recruitment has been shocking since Wembley.

    Shackell is the best centre-half we have he should be in the team as captain, he may not be the best ambassador for the club but on field should take priority. That has been a major error and as several managers have made Keogh captain you have to wonder has that come from above because from a football perspective it is so clearly flawed.

    The recruitment has been awful, Mac got it wrong after Wembley not improving the back four but a lot more damage was done in between his tenures. Anya is another head down man we have plenty already, Vydra hasn't done much for several seasons, midfield balance hasn't been right all season. Thorne has been a massive loss, all the more galling that the buffoon in charge at the time stupidly picked him for a meaningless fixture he got a horrible broken leg in, selling Hendrick and bringing lesser players in with the money wasn't bright either.

    Butterfield needs pace around him, so does Johnson, not much thought or planning Mac was left with a mess coming back but he didn't do enough this January to wheel and deal a more balanced squad.
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    Re: sack them all

    Post by chicken on Wed 15 Feb 2017, 10:50 am

    Funny you should say that about Keogh, but apparently he is a good friend of Mel Morris.  I've heard some stuff that's not particularly complimentary about him too. I don't know whether it's true or not.
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    swadieram

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by swadieram on Wed 15 Feb 2017, 10:57 am

    Not a Pearson fan but I wish he'd been allowed to stop a few more week to sort them out !

    I cannot see us going up with Mac

    & please don't get me started on Keogh
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    mcsilks

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by mcsilks on Wed 15 Feb 2017, 11:25 am

    purpleram wrote:I don't think it's that the players aren't good enough, they can beat anyone on their day.

    Look at Derby v Hull last season as proof in the pudding. Regularly out-played Hull, actually beat up on them a bit, until it mattered and the lack of bottle, character whatever it is reared it's head.

    This team, and this manager are mentally weak, whether it can be changed by signing a Hindmarchesq character I don't know, but as the squad/manager stands we will never amount to a hill of beans.


    Completely agree. We have a squad that would walk into the top 6 and challenge the top 2 given the right management.

    Steve McClaren is one of the best number two's in English football and it is in that position he should stay.

    I would love it if he took a step down, stayed with DCFC as the Head Coach and we brought in somebody who is capable of managing this team of individuals.

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    bramhallram

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by bramhallram on Wed 15 Feb 2017, 12:08 pm

    mcsilks wrote:
    purpleram wrote:I don't think it's that the players aren't good enough, they can beat anyone on their day.

    Look at Derby v Hull last season as proof in the pudding. Regularly out-played Hull, actually beat up on them a bit, until it mattered and the lack of bottle, character whatever it is reared it's head.

    This team, and this manager are mentally weak, whether it can be changed by signing a Hindmarchesq character I don't know, but as the squad/manager stands we will never amount to a hill of beans.


    Completely agree. We have a squad that would walk into the top 6 and challenge the top 2 given the right management.

    Steve McClaren is one of the best number two's in English football and it is in that position he should stay.

    I would love it if he took a step down, stayed with DCFC as the Head Coach and we brought in somebody who is capable of managing this team of individuals.

    I agree with your suggestion. Some of the best football we've seen from Derby at PP was under the Jim Smith/Steve Mac regime. We need to get back to this type of management team if we're to be successful.

    Some people aren't meant to be the top boss, and I think SM is one of them. Whether SM would accept such a change is open to debate, but if nothing changes we can forget the play offs next season as well as this one.

    .
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    Re: sack them all

    Post by Loughborough Ram on Wed 15 Feb 2017, 3:42 pm

    Whilst I was against the appointment of McLaren I think it would be wrong to get rid of him at this point. I don't rate him as a coach, I don't like his personality and I wouldn't trust him as far as I could spit him but in my opinion we would be making our club into a bigger laughing stock than Forest if we sacked another manager so soon into the job.

    In my opinion the club made a concious decision before the transfer window opened to focus on the summer for player recruitment and consequently aren't counting on a promotion push this season. If we are no further on in 12 months time , which I expect we won't be, then I think that there can be no complaints if he is sacked, but to do it now just makes us look like a bunch of clueless, knee jerk idiots.
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    Re: sack them all

    Post by rjrules71 on Wed 15 Feb 2017, 3:46 pm

    bramhallram wrote:
    mcsilks wrote:
    purpleram wrote:I don't think it's that the players aren't good enough, they can beat anyone on their day.

    Look at Derby v Hull last season as proof in the pudding. Regularly out-played Hull, actually beat up on them a bit, until it mattered and the lack of bottle, character whatever it is reared it's head.

    This team, and this manager are mentally weak, whether it can be changed by signing a Hindmarchesq character I don't know, but as the squad/manager stands we will never amount to a hill of beans.


    Completely agree. We have a squad that would walk into the top 6 and challenge the top 2 given the right management.

    Steve McClaren is one of the best number two's in English football and it is in that position he should stay.

    I would love it if he took a step down, stayed with DCFC as the Head Coach and we brought in somebody who is capable of managing this team of individuals.

    I agree with your suggestion. Some of the best football we've seen from Derby at PP was under the Jim Smith/Steve Mac regime. We need to get back to this type of management team if we're to be successful.

    Some people aren't meant to be the top boss, and I think SM is one of them. Whether SM would accept such a change is open to debate, but if nothing changes we can forget the play offs next season as well as this one.

    .


    So right BR, and I think this is the nub of the matter, we need a younger manager who is chomping at the bit Eddie Howe/ Garry Monk/Gary Rowett type.
    Experienced enough but still full of piss and vinegar, with the the right backing over 2 seasons, to allow him time to develop himself and the squad.
    SM has had his turn/day and needs turning out to grass.



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    Re: sack them all

    Post by New England Ram on Wed 15 Feb 2017, 4:59 pm

    Always said I think you need a character in charge to get this club out this division...less on tactics and more about man management...you would have thought Pearson was that man but that was a fewkin disaster ..
    Don't think SM will be pushed anytime soon...at least until next season.
    So a week after he sat his squad down to tell them it was up to them to secure a playoff squad.
    I reckon he should now sit them down...tell them they fewked that up...it's gone now.
    And play the cliche " just play one half at a time relax and enjoy yourself" card...



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    purpleram

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by purpleram on Wed 15 Feb 2017, 5:19 pm

    I think Pearson, but I'm not privy to the internal gossip at the club, was only a disaster because the matey, cosy, over comfortable atmosphere at Derby reacted so badly to it. Maybe it needed a root and branch change that the club, Mel included couldn't stomach.

    Lets be honest, none of what the clubs tried post Clough has worked. Before the Clough haters start he fulfilled his remit, whether he could have took us to the next level can only be conjecture.

    The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results”

    Mac is using the same old tactics, mostly the same old players, failing in the same old way.

    We had the chance with Pearson for a new start but the club bottled it.
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    old ewe

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    Re: sack them all

    Post by old ewe on Wed 15 Feb 2017, 5:52 pm

    Our club is in a mess. Re-employing our ex- head coach who failed and re-naming him as Manager was never going to be a long term answer. We had the honeymoon period again and now the same old, same old downward drifting, undiciplined, incohesive, baffled group of players and manager. He repeatedly says the management know what they want/what is wrong/ how to put things right. but either the players cannot respond or the manager cannot get his message across adequately. or create a properly functioning team out of a group of individuals The latter is what management is all about. This is where he fails repeatedly .

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