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    Tactics

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    MadAmster

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    Tactics

    Post by MadAmster on Tue 28 Feb 2017, 5:05 pm

    ..... overrated? overhyped?

    Who knows? What I question is the need for a back 4 when the opposition usually play with 1 or 2 up top.

    3 is sufficient IMO for most opponents.

    This would allow us to have 4 or even 5 (1-3-5-2) in midfield, rather than 3 and we ought to boss the middle of the park.

    Your thoughts please.......




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    norfolkram

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    Re: Tactics

    Post by norfolkram on Tue 28 Feb 2017, 5:57 pm

    MadAmster wrote:..... overrated? overhyped?

    Who knows? What I question is the need for a back 4 when the opposition usually play with 1 or 2 up top.

    3 is sufficient IMO for most opponents.

    This would allow us to have 4 or even 5 (1-3-5-2) in midfield, rather than 3 and we ought to boss the middle of the park.

    Your thoughts please.......


    If that was a good idea dont you think our genius of a manager would have tried it. LOL roll LOL roll LOL roll
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    Jackal

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    Re: Tactics

    Post by Jackal on Tue 28 Feb 2017, 6:09 pm

    Keogh is our most mobile centre back and he's injured. I think the others are a bit slow leaving time and space in the channels and wings. We could play a fullback(s) in the 3 but Lowe is inexperienced, I doubt Olsson would suit, Anya too small so only leaves Christie and that doesn't inspire me with confidence. By Steve's recent interview it looks like the only 2 centre backs we'll have fit for Blackburn are Pearce & Baird. Could've done with Rawson right now. 3-5-2 may be an option in the future but i don't think it'll actually happen.



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    Stockport Ram

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    Re: Tactics

    Post by Stockport Ram on Tue 28 Feb 2017, 6:53 pm

    Jackal wrote:Keogh is our most mobile centre back and he's injured. I think the others are a bit slow leaving time and space in the channels and wings. We could play a fullback(s) in the 3 but Lowe is inexperienced, I doubt Olsson would suit, Anya too small so only leaves Christie and that doesn't inspire me with confidence. By Steve's recent interview it looks like the only 2 centre backs we'll have fit for Blackburn are Pearce & Baird. Could've done with Rawson right now. 3-5-2 may be an option in the future but i don't think it'll actually happen.


    Shouldn't this be in the "A bit of positivity on here for a change" thread???
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    Re: Tactics

    Post by chicken on Tue 28 Feb 2017, 6:54 pm

    Stockport Ram wrote:
    Jackal wrote:Keogh is our most mobile centre back and he's injured. I think the others are a bit slow leaving time and space in the channels and wings. We could play a fullback(s) in the 3 but Lowe is inexperienced, I doubt Olsson would suit, Anya too small so only leaves Christie and that doesn't inspire me with confidence. By Steve's recent interview it looks like the only 2 centre backs we'll have fit for Blackburn are Pearce & Baird. Could've done with Rawson right now. 3-5-2 may be an option in the future but i don't think it'll actually happen.


    Shouldn't this be in the "A bit of positivity on here for a change" thread???
    LOL roll LOL roll
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    Jackal

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    Re: Tactics

    Post by Jackal on Tue 28 Feb 2017, 7:38 pm

    I'll show some positivity when i feel it. Could be waiting a while.



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    Re: Tactics

    Post by purpleram on Wed 01 Mar 2017, 8:24 pm

    Tactics be damned. That team should be winning week in, week out, lack of back bone apart.

    It's been the lack of tempo for the last 2 - 1/2 years, if you can't fashion a team and formation out of our squad, then you should be sacked.
    Yes the balance isn't right and needs rebuilding, but only because they have no bottle, not because they aren't good enough.
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    Re: Tactics

    Post by Angus1 on Thu 02 Mar 2017, 8:25 am

    purpleram wrote:Tactics be damned. That team should be winning week in, week out, lack of back bone apart.

    It's been the lack of tempo for the last 2 - 1/2 years, if you can't fashion a team and formation out of our squad, then you should be sacked.
    Yes the balance isn't right and needs rebuilding, but only because they have no bottle, not because they aren't good enough.

    The squad balance isn't good enough to win week in week out this season, it wouldn't matter if Conte or Mourinho were Derby manager we wouldn't be going up. It wouldn't matter who we play on the left wing head down no vision, no craft, all the central midfielders offer the same weakness no pace, the only full-back we have on the books who can get into proper starting position automatically is 36, none of the centre-forwards we have can play with back to goal and hold the ball consistently under physical pressure from 6 foot 2 centre halfs.

    All this Mac inherited, last summer was a disaster starting with that buffoon playing Thorne in a meaningless match. There is no balance in the squad so that Mac can significantly vary the tactics, whoever he picks weakness is there for opponents. He can either go 6 or 7 defensive behind the ball tight and cagey games, or let more midfielders play attacking and we concede plenty. I am sure he doesn't ideally want to play the likes of Hughes, Butterfield, Russell and Bryson so defensively but has to.
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    thatguyfromderby

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    Re: Tactics

    Post by thatguyfromderby on Thu 02 Mar 2017, 1:46 pm

    Angus1 wrote:
    purpleram wrote:Tactics be damned. That team should be winning week in, week out, lack of back bone apart.

    It's been the lack of tempo for the last 2 - 1/2 years, if you can't fashion a team and formation out of our squad, then you should be sacked.
    Yes the balance isn't right and needs rebuilding, but only because they have no bottle, not because they aren't good enough.

    The squad balance isn't good enough to win week in week out this season, it wouldn't matter if Conte or Mourinho were Derby manager we wouldn't be going up. It wouldn't matter who we play on the left wing head down no vision, no craft, all the central midfielders offer the same weakness no pace, the only full-back we have on the books who can get into proper starting position automatically is 36, none of the centre-forwards we have can play with back to goal and hold the ball consistently under physical pressure from 6 foot 2 centre halfs.

    All this Mac inherited, last summer was a disaster starting with that buffoon playing Thorne in a meaningless match. There is no balance in the squad so that Mac can significantly vary the tactics, whoever he picks weakness is there for opponents. He can either go 6 or 7 defensive behind the ball tight and cagey  games, or let more midfielders play attacking and we concede plenty. I am sure he doesn't ideally want to play the likes of Hughes, Butterfield, Russell and Bryson so defensively but has to.

    So what's the reason the team he built failed to get into the top 6 last time?

    alongside that, is he also not at fault for failing to address ANY of these issues you mentioned during the January window? Is he not the man that brought in Nuggent for £2.5m.. a player we all know is not a solitary striker? Is he not the man that offered Martin, a player not currently at the club, a lucrative new deal? Steve McClaren is not blameless. It currently feels like he inherited a sinking ship and decided he should add some new holes of his own. His inflexibility will be his downfall.. AGAIN.
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    Re: Tactics

    Post by chicken on Thu 02 Mar 2017, 6:10 pm

    Steve McClaren dropping big hints that he will change the formation on Saturday. #dcfcfans
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    CornwallRam

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    Re: Tactics

    Post by CornwallRam on Thu 02 Mar 2017, 9:49 pm

    It's bound to be 541, with us only having one centre back available and no target man
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    Re: Tactics

    Post by SawleyRam on Thu 02 Mar 2017, 11:13 pm

    CornwallRam wrote:It's bound to be 541, with us only having one centre back available and no target man

    If a change is to be made it will be 3 - 5 - 2 with midfield runners (if they feel up to the challenge!)
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    Re: Tactics

    Post by SawleyRam on Thu 02 Mar 2017, 11:31 pm

    SawleyRam wrote:
    CornwallRam wrote:It's bound to be 541, with us only having one centre back available and no target man

    If a change is to be made it will be 3 - 5 - 2 with midfield runners (if they feel up to the challenge!)

    Carson

    Baird - Pearce - Lowe

    Ince - Hughes - Johnson - Butterfield - Anya

    Nugent - Bent.

    Subs: Shackell - Bennett - Christie - Camara - De Sart - Vydra - Russell


    Last edited by SawleyRam on Fri 03 Mar 2017, 10:20 am; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : Put Bent in instead of Vydra)
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    Re: Tactics

    Post by Jackal on Fri 03 Mar 2017, 10:44 am

    I reckon it'll be this, if there's any change at all in the first half:

                                  Carson
    Christie       Baird                  Pearce       Lowe
                    
                      Johnson              De Sart

    Ince                        Hughes                   Russell

                                  Nugent



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    valakari

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    Re: Tactics

    Post by valakari on Fri 03 Mar 2017, 5:38 pm

    Jackal wrote:I reckon it'll be this, if there's any change at all in the first half:

                                  Carson
    Christie       Baird                  Pearce       Lowe
                    
                      Johnson              De Sart

    Ince                        Hughes                   Russell

                                  Nugent
    So do i...spot on
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    MadAmster

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    Re: Tactics

    Post by MadAmster on Sat 04 Mar 2017, 8:35 am

    With regard to the suggested lineups by various fellow fans on here, as laudable as they are, they will, IMO, come to nought UNLESS the chosen players in the chosen formation (sorry for the upcoming repetition) :

    1. Play with heart from the off
    2. Press the oppo when they have the ball
    3. Mark players rather than space
    4. High tempo ball circulation
    5. One and two touch passing, preferably forwards
    6. When not in possession, get in position
    7. Don't even think about whether or not you like the guy in the white shirt who is in a far better position than you, give him a good pass, it's the white shirt you are playing with, not the guy wearing it.



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    Loughborough Ram

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    Re: Tactics

    Post by Loughborough Ram on Sat 04 Mar 2017, 9:15 am

    And none of that matters until McLaren accepts that 4-1-4-1 isn't working
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    Re: Tactics

    Post by MadAmster on Sat 04 Mar 2017, 2:46 pm

    Loughborough Ram wrote:And none of that matters until McLaren accepts that 4-1-4-1 isn't working

    1-4-2-3-1 today.........



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    Re: Tactics

    Post by RRC on Sat 04 Mar 2017, 2:50 pm

    MadAmster wrote:
    Loughborough Ram wrote:And none of that matters until McLaren accepts that 4-1-4-1 isn't working

    1-4-2-3-1 today.........

    or 1--4--shambles?



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    Re: Tactics

    Post by MadAmster on Sat 04 Mar 2017, 3:00 pm

    Nothing should be discounted RRC



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    Re: Tactics

    Post by valakari on Sun 05 Mar 2017, 10:35 am

    RRC. It is apparent you didn't go..and he tried a plan b...and we won. #timetoshutup
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    Re: Tactics

    Post by RRC on Sun 05 Mar 2017, 10:57 am

    valakari wrote:RRC. It is apparent you didn't go..and he tried a plan b...and we won. #timetoshutup

    Please don't tell me or any forum member to shut up. Everyone is entitled to post
    their views and the forum would be very dull if we all agreed.

    If you looked at the time of my post, you'd have seen that it was posted BEFORE the match,
    when it was anyone's guess about the shape of the team and how well it would work,
    though it was clearly going to be a change from the 4-3-3 that hasn't been working.

    I hope SM sticks to that and the same players -- but start with Butterfield in MF and perhaps
    swap Ince's and Vydra's positions -- but I fear he won't.

    BTW SM said that Bent would have played instead of Russell but for illness, so what would the
    formation have been if he had played?



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    Re: Tactics

    Post by CornwallRam on Sun 05 Mar 2017, 12:05 pm

    RRC wrote:
    valakari wrote:RRC. It is apparent you didn't go..and he tried a plan b...and we won. #timetoshutup

    Please don't tell me or any forum member to shut up. Everyone is entitled to post
    their views and the forum would be very dull if we all agreed.

    If you looked at the time of my post, you'd have seen that it was posted BEFORE the match,
    when it was anyone's guess about the shape of the team and how well it would work,
    though it was clearly going to be a change from the 4-3-3 that hasn't been working.

    I hope SM sticks to that and the same players -- but start with Butterfield in MF and perhaps
    swap Ince's and Vydra's positions -- but I fear he won't.

    BTW SM said that Bent would have played instead of Russell but for illness, so what would the
    formation have been if he had played?

    Presumably Vydra wide left, Ince in the middle, Nugent wide right and Bent offside
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    Re: Tactics

    Post by DavesaRam on Sun 05 Mar 2017, 1:13 pm

    MadAmster wrote:With regard to the suggested lineups by various fellow fans on here, as laudable as they are, they will, IMO, come to nought UNLESS the chosen players in the chosen formation (sorry for the upcoming repetition) :

    1. Play with heart from the off
    2. Press the oppo when they have the ball
    3. Mark players rather than space
    4. High tempo ball circulation
    5. One and two touch passing, preferably forwards
    6. When not in possession, get in position
    7. Don't even think about whether or not you like the guy in the  white shirt who is in a far better position than you, give him a good pass, it's the white shirt you are playing with, not the guy wearing it.

    Thumbs up



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    Re: Tactics

    Post by RoytheRam on Sun 05 Mar 2017, 2:21 pm

    MadAmster wrote:..... overrated? overhyped?

    Who knows? What I question is the need for a back 4 when the opposition usually play with 1 or 2 up top.

    3 is sufficient IMO for most opponents.

    This would allow us to have 4 or even 5 (1-3-5-2) in midfield, rather than 3 and we ought to boss the middle of the park.

    Your thoughts please.......



    I,ve been saying the same thing for months mate! Obviously while Keogh and Shackell have been injured but still not impossible.
    Give the man time though, after all he's only just realised that you don't have to play 4-3-3! Given time he might even learn how to spell tactic. I do wish someone would point out to him though that in Vydra he has probably got 1 of the best off the striker players around! Certainly in this league, so why the hell does he insist when he does bring him on or even start him (shock horror) on playing him wide left or elsewhere other than where he could do considerable damage given the right players and service to said players! I thought and indeed been led to believe by knowledgeable others that Mac' was a top coach. I'm afraid other than making training very pleasant and enjoyable for players wherever he's been I have yet to see 1 piece of evidence to support this! So don't start talking about tactics in the same sentence as our manager, you're just wasting your breath1

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