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    Next Season

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    Loughborough Ram

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    Next Season

    Post by Loughborough Ram on Thu 12 Apr 2018, 3:15 pm

    If we fail to reach the Premiersh*t this season, considering the information that we've been given about the need to sell before we can buy and the difficulty we know that we will have shifting players on big money, what would your plans be this summer if you were in charge?

    Would you sell Vydra to raise funds, bearing in mind where we would be without his goals this season? Would you pay fringe players off and concentrate on season long loans or maybe you have even better idea of your own.
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    mcsilks

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    Re: Next Season

    Post by mcsilks on Thu 12 Apr 2018, 3:25 pm

    To a certain extent, we've created a rod for our own backs giving players like Ledley, Jerome, Anya, Johnson, Nugent, Olsson, and Thorne long contracts.

    We cannot realistically move forward as a club while we have such a top heavy squad with aged, average players.

    It may be a case of having to offload the likes of Vydra, as he himself must surely realise that DCFC cannot really go progress with the current squad of players.

    It's difficult to gauge next season as we don't really know if we have any youth players that are likely to break through. If we don't, then it looks likely that we'll be reliant on the loan system.

    Exciting times.

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    Jackal

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    Re: Next Season

    Post by Jackal on Thu 12 Apr 2018, 3:26 pm

    Bent and Shackell look like goners, so there's a bit off the wage bill. If a decent bid came in for Martin i'd say take it, seeing as he doesn't seem to figure in Rowett's plans. I'd personally try to get Palmer and  Winnall back in on loan again if the latter regains full fitness. A new leftback seems a must and a centre midfielder with pace and energy to play one of the holding roles if Gary won't trust Palmer to play in that position.
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    MadAmster

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    Re: Next Season

    Post by MadAmster on Thu 12 Apr 2018, 4:23 pm

    Bent & Shackell are out of contract in the summer and won't get new ones. Same is true of Roos IMO. Hanson will get a new one. There is a 5th player out of contract but I can't remember who.

    We need to put some pace and mobility into the midfield without losing the solidity we showed October to January.

    That will mean losing some of the slower players.
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    bramhallram

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    Re: Next Season

    Post by bramhallram on Thu 12 Apr 2018, 5:24 pm

    mcsilks wrote:To a certain extent, we've created a rod for our own backs giving players like Ledley, Jerome, Anya, Johnson, Nugent, Olsson, and Thorne long contracts.


    Agreed. I've always assumed that those signings were part of a short term plan to achieve the goal set by MM of a top six finish this season, and would be replaced by a younger, more mobile set of players if we got promoted. This could still happen if we get lucky over the next few weeks.  

    MM has made it clear that unless we go up he isn't going to throw £millions at signing new players, so it looks like the Academy may have to provide some gems for next season.

    .
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    whestonram

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    Re: Next Season

    Post by whestonram on Thu 12 Apr 2018, 5:39 pm

    bramhallram wrote:
    mcsilks wrote:To a certain extent, we've created a rod for our own backs giving players like Ledley, Jerome, Anya, Johnson, Nugent, Olsson, and Thorne long contracts.


    Agreed. I've always assumed that those signings were part of a short term plan to achieve the goal set by MM of a top six finish this season, and would be replaced by a younger, more mobile set of players if we got promoted. This could still happen if we get lucky over the next few weeks.  

    MM has made it clear that unless we go up he isn't going to throw £millions at signing new players, so it looks like the Academy may have to provide some gems for next season.

    .

    Yes, I actually agree with MC on this. We need more energy in midfield, so an upgrade on Ledley, and we really need a good centre forward. Neither Nugent or Jerome are good enough, and I don't know about Winnall. And, as others have said, a decent left back.
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    RRC
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    Re: Next Season

    Post by RRC on Thu 12 Apr 2018, 7:55 pm

    As far as I can tell, decisions will be needed about these 18 players before this December.

    These 5 players (3 over 30 years now) seem to be out of contract this summer --
    Roos, (26)
    Baird, (36)
    Shackell, (35)
    Hanson (23)
    Bent (34)

    These 13 players (9 over 30 years now) seem to be out of contract in summer 2019 --
    Davies (34)
    Olsson (31)
    Pearce (30)
    Bryson (31)
    Butterfield (28)
    Huddlestone (31)
    Ledley (31)
    Blackman (27)
    Jerome (31)
    Johnson(31)
    Nugent (33)
    Vernam (21)
    Weimann (26)

    Also some of these (and others) may be on the verge of the first team but contract dates not known --
    Bird (17)
    Elsnik (20)
    Gordon (20)
    Guy (20)
    Lowe (21)
    McAllister (19)
    Stabana (19)
    Thomas (19)
    Zanzala (22)

    That seems to leave these 11 players with at least 2 years left on their contracts --
    Scott Carson (32)
    Jonathan Mitchell (23)
    Craig Forsyth (29)
    Richard Keogh (31)
    Andre Wisdom (25)
    George Thorne (25)
    Ikechi Anya (30)
    Mason Bennett (21)
    Chris Martin (29)
    Matej Vydra (26)
    Tom Lawrence (24)

    DCFC will have to make a lot of big decisions by this December.



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    Calif_Ramette

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    Re: Next Season

    Post by Calif_Ramette on Thu 12 Apr 2018, 10:14 pm

    These 5 players (3 over 30 years now) seem to be out of contract this summer --
    Roos, (26) - no
    Baird, (36) - No
    Shackell, (35) - No
    Hanson (23) -Yes
    Bent (34) -No

    These 13 players (9 over 30 years now) seem to be out of contract in summer 2019 --
    Davies (34) - No
    Olsson (31) - No
    Pearce (30) - No
    Bryson (31) - No, try to sell
    Butterfield (28) - Dear God no
    Huddlestone (31) - Keep until contract expires
    Ledley (31) - Maybe
    Blackman (27) - No
    Jerome (31) - Nope
    Johnson(31) - Not sure
    Nugent (33) - No
    Vernam (21) - Not sure
    Weimann (26) - Keep

    Also some of these (and others) may be on the verge of the first team but contract dates not known --
    Bird (17)
    Elsnik (20)
    Gordon (20)
    Guy (20)
    Lowe (21)
    McAllister (19)
    Stabana (19)
    Thomas (19)
    Zanzala (22)

    That seems to leave these 11 players with at least 2 years left on their contracts --
    Scott Carson (32) - Keep, Keepers tend to peak from about 28-34
    Jonathan Mitchell (23) - Keep
    Craig Forsyth (29) - Not sure
    Richard Keogh (31) - Nope, thanks for your service it can get rid of earlier do it
    Andre Wisdom (25) - Keep
    George Thorne (25) - Yes but worried since he seems made of glass
    Ikechi Anya (30) - Meh
    Mason Bennett (21) - No, made of glass
    Chris Martin (29) - Sell if can, doesnt fit in Rowetts system
    Matej Vydra (26) - God yes
    Tom Lawrence (24) - God yes

    Those are my takes.
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    mcsilks

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    Re: Next Season

    Post by mcsilks on Fri 13 Apr 2018, 2:54 am

    I would quite happily take/accept a lower mid-table position next season if the team includes some young players and shows signs of a rebuilding programme.

    What I don't want to see is a regurgitation of this season with a laborious brand of football and happily playing second fiddle to sides waiting to pick them off.

    Lord only knows what GR is going to do about the problem he has with an already inflated squad.

    He's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't. He cannot have players on big money sitting there not playing or even being part of the first team set up. I fear his only option is to continue with the same team, and the same style for another season when those players will be out of contract.

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    MadAmster

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    Re: Next Season

    Post by MadAmster on Fri 13 Apr 2018, 7:41 am

    Looking at the SQUAD rather than the team..........

    These 5 players (3 over 30 years now) seem to be out of contract this summer --
    Roos, (26) - Doesn't seem to have developed as was thought when we bought him. has done very well out on loan in L1/L2
    Baird, (36) - I would keep him as cover for all 4 back 4 (back 3?) roles on a 1 year contract
    Shackell, (35) - No
    Hanson (23) - Yes.
    Bent (34) -No

    These 13 players (9 over 30 years now) seem to be out of contract in summer 2019 --
    Davies (34) - Has a year left and is good enough.
    Olsson (31) - Either him or Fozzy as cover for Lowe
    Pearce (30) - Yes. Another season as quality cover or Keogh's replacement
    Bryson (31) - No, try to sell
    Butterfield (28) - Dear God no
    Huddlestone (31) - Keep until contract expires
    Ledley (31) - Won't want to be cover so sell
    Blackman (27) - Hell No
    Jerome (31) - We will need either him or Nuge we can't affoird two new #9's. He is younger and faster so yes
    Johnson(31) - BJ as cover for Hudds/Hanson and can also play AM so one more season
    Nugent (33) - No.
    Vernam (21) - Keep.
    Weimann (26) - Keep

    Also some of these (and others) may be on the verge of the first team but contract dates not known --
    Bird (17) Good enough to be a squad member
    Elsnik (20) Yes
    Gordon (20) Good cover
    Guy (20) Yes
    Lowe (21) Yes
    McAllister (19) U23s for now
    Stabana (19) U23s for now
    Thomas (19) Hell yes
    Zanzala (22) Cover

    That seems to leave these 11 players with at least 2 years left on their contracts --
    Scott Carson (32) - Hell yeah
    Jonathan Mitchell (23) - Keep
    Craig Forsyth (29) - Him or Olsson as cover for Lowe
    Richard Keogh (31) - Cover for Pearce? Better as right wing back in a midfield 5.
    Andre Wisdom (25) - Keep
    George Thorne (25) - Yes but worried since he seems made of glass and teams probably won't take him because of that.
    Ikechi Anya (30) - Left or right wing. left or right back. Good cover player
    Mason Bennett (21) - Probably to go but Rowett likes him (as do I) so may get a last chance at breaking through.
    Chris Martin (29) - Sell! Doesnt fit in Rowett's system bad for both club and player to keep him.
    Matej Vydra (26) - Hell yeah
    Tom Lawrence (24) - Only if he can get a more central role. He is wasted out wide. Can we find a system to accomodate both him and Vydra? I think so. Give Vydra a free role up top alongside whoever our #9 might be.

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    rob

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    Re: Next Season

    Post by rob on Fri 13 Apr 2018, 9:19 am

    Next season is when I will start to judge Rowett - but agreed we have too many players on big long contracts so it may take 2-3 years to clear up the squad...... again

    And based on his recruitment record to date - if I was Mel I would be reluctant to give Rowett big bucks - lets try finding some lower/non league gems rather than "proven" championship players seeking either their last or next big pay cheque
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    RRC
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    Re: Next Season

    Post by RRC on Fri 13 Apr 2018, 3:07 pm

    I posted some views on another thread so I won't repeat them in full here --
    http://dcfc-craic.forumotion.net/t19585p50-first-6-minutes-of-derby-football#319233

    Imho next season will be another year of transition -- most of the squad needs replacing
    and we'll need better scouting to get better signings at reasonable costs.

    If we stick rigidly with the same formation and passive style of play, we'll go backwards.
    Treading water gets you nowhere in this league.

    We are not too big to go down but, short of a disaster, we should at least avoid that.



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    rob

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    Re: Next Season

    Post by rob on Fri 13 Apr 2018, 3:11 pm

    when you have millions to spend it is easy to spend it - to unearth quality from the lower leagues takes skill luck and investment in time.

    We haven't signed anyone decent from the lower leagues since Nigel's days
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    SawleyRam

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    Re: Next Season

    Post by SawleyRam on Fri 13 Apr 2018, 5:28 pm

    Reading the above threads a thought occurred about Sam Rush.

    We now know that he negotiated contracts (not Gary Rowett) so wages and long contracts are down to Rush. He was also complicit in bringing Judas to the club (twice).

    How long will it take to clear Sam's alleged indiscretions up? One season two possibly. It's the Derby way.
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    MadAmster

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    Re: Next Season

    Post by MadAmster on Sat 14 Apr 2018, 7:44 am

    rob wrote:when you have millions to spend it is easy to spend it - to unearth quality from the lower leagues takes skill luck and investment in time.

    We haven't signed anyone decent from the lower leagues since Nigel's days

    The bit in bold is almost spot on........ you just need to remove the word decent.

    Someone might like to throw Ledley's name at me but although he was unattached, he was and still is a current Wales international.
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    valakari

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    Re: Next Season

    Post by valakari on Sat 14 Apr 2018, 8:35 pm

    i'd throw Ledleys name somewhere Mad, but it would be in the direction of the dole office...him and Cameron, what was Gary thinking...stupid boy!..(reference to Dads Army for those of you too young....)

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