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    World Cup Watch

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    rob

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by rob on Wed 27 Jun 2018, 12:03 pm

    not as obviously fixed as the Germany /Austria game from '82 - that is when they changed it so both final games had to kick off at the same time. Won't stop that sort of thing happening granted.

    Still I don't think any team has consistently impressed - Uruguay's group was easy - Columbia and Senegal are hot and cold and the "big" teams are inconsistent at best - if we beat Belgium I think we will have been the best team in the group stages.

    Not getting carried away and if we go out fighting in the next round it will still be a good world cup imo.
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    outsider

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by outsider on Wed 27 Jun 2018, 2:11 pm

    rob wrote:not as obviously fixed as the Germany /Austria game from '82 - that is when they changed it so both final games had to kick off at the same time.  Won't stop that sort of thing happening granted.

    Still I don't think any team has consistently impressed - Uruguay's group was easy - Columbia and Senegal are hot and cold and the "big" teams are inconsistent at best - if we beat Belgium I think we will have been the best team in the group stages.

    Not getting carried away and if we go out fighting in the next round it will still be a good world cup imo.

    I think England have got a better chance this year as the top teams have not really been impressive, im not a England hater and good luck to them but please don't win it we fed was up of 1966 ffs so we have to suffer another 50 odd years of it Bang head Bang head Bang head


    LOL LOL LOL LOL
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    Loughborough Ram

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by Loughborough Ram on Wed 27 Jun 2018, 2:28 pm

    I thought that reaching the semi final of the Euros was the pinnacle of football achievement so I doubt we'll be too bad England
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    outsider

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by outsider on Wed 27 Jun 2018, 2:41 pm

    Loughborough Ram wrote:I thought that reaching the semi final of the Euros was the pinnacle of football achievement so I doubt we'll be too bad England


    I pinnacle that I doubt I will ever see again. but like seeing derby win the premier or wales qualifying for a world cup final … probable not in my life time.

    a lot of debate on should wales Scotland etc get behind England to win the world cup, I would not support another country and I doubt any of you would to, but I would not go as far as shouting out for any one but England attitude. I find it hypocritical how some welsh are spouting anti English and support an English team. I enjoyed watching italia 90 and England as there was 2 derby players in it so it gave me more interest
    like I said previously I don't mind how you get on but don't win it LOL roll LOL roll
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    Loughborough Ram

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by Loughborough Ram on Wed 27 Jun 2018, 2:57 pm

    I would support the other home nations as long as we weren't involved, if we were, as in the Euros, I wanted everyone to do well, but not better than us, strange philosophy I know but your heart does what it does I guess.
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    outsider

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by outsider on Wed 27 Jun 2018, 3:01 pm

    Loughborough Ram wrote:I would support the other home nations as long as we weren't involved, if we were, as in the Euros, I wanted everyone to do well, but not better than us, strange philosophy I know but your heart does what it does I guess.

    even the scots Afraid
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    Loughborough Ram

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by Loughborough Ram on Wed 27 Jun 2018, 5:20 pm

    Yes. I was right behind them in 78, but it's probably a sympathy thing these days to be fair.
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    SawleyRam

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by SawleyRam on Wed 27 Jun 2018, 5:42 pm

    Well Loughie I hope you have softened a little about VAR, now it has been implemented, correctly so, to eliminate Germany. Ref made a wrong call, saw VAR and changed his call. Well done all round.
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    MadAmster

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by MadAmster on Wed 27 Jun 2018, 6:22 pm

    Whatever you do, when talking to Germans...... don't mention ze VAR!!
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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by Calif_Ramette on Wed 27 Jun 2018, 9:31 pm

    The last 3 winners of the World Cup have been bounced out at the Group Stage in the following WC. Not encouraging for whoever wins this one for the farce in Qatar.
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    MadAmster

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by MadAmster on Wed 27 Jun 2018, 10:21 pm

    Calif_Ramette wrote:The last 3 winners of the World Cup have been bounced out at the Group Stage in the following WC. Not encouraging for whoever wins this one for the farce in Qatar.

    4 of the last 5.......
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    New England Ram
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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by New England Ram on Thu 28 Jun 2018, 1:03 am

    outsider wrote:
    Loughborough Ram wrote:I thought that reaching the semi final of the Euros was the pinnacle of football achievement so I doubt we'll be too bad England


    I pinnacle that I doubt I will ever see again. but like seeing derby win the premier or wales qualifying for a world cup final … probable not in my life time.

    a lot of debate on should wales Scotland etc get behind England to win the world cup, I would not support another country and I doubt any of you would to, but I would not go as far as shouting out for any one but England attitude. I find it hypocritical how some welsh are spouting anti English and support an English team. I enjoyed watching italia 90 and England as there was 2 derby players in it so it gave me more interest
    like I said previously I don't mind how you get on but don't win it LOL roll LOL roll

    In the 70s and 80s I always rooted for the home nations...but the anti English rhetoric got a bit out of hand for my liking after that and so it was and is hard to get behind other teams..which is a shame.
    I used to support other club teams in Europe as well when it was just British players..no more.



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    Stockport Ram

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by Stockport Ram on Thu 28 Jun 2018, 6:25 am

    Apart from Archie's wonder goal V Holland in '78, I wanted the Scots to embarrass themselves after their fans tore the Wembley crossbar apart the previous year.....and they did.
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    MadAmster

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by MadAmster on Thu 28 Jun 2018, 8:09 am

    Korea's first goal. Would you have allowed it? I wouldn't. IMO VAR got it wrong. The question is, was it all in the same phase of play or was it a second phase? I say 1st phase in which case the Korean attacker gained an advantage from being in an offside position.

    Let's take a look at what happened.

    1. the ball comes over
    2. A Korean player heads it forwards into the mix and the eventual scorer is stood offside
    3. the ball lands at Kroos's feet and he attempts to clear but only manages to toepoke it to the player whose is stood in an offside position.
    4. the Korean player scores.

    IMO that is one phase of play and therefore the player was offside and the goal should not have stood.

    Having said that, I am so very glad it did as I have now seen a Group stage end with Germany bottom. It's never happened before and will very likely not happen again in the next 100 years.

    The image below is taken from the FIFA Offside Law description and is why I think the goal should not have stood. I look forward to your various perspectives on it.

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    SawleyRam

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by SawleyRam on Thu 28 Jun 2018, 9:37 am

    MadAmster wrote:Korea's first goal. Would you have allowed it? I wouldn't. IMO VAR got it wrong. The question is, was it all in the same phase of play or was it a second phase? I say 1st phase in which case the Korean attacker gained an advantage from being in an offside position.

    Let's take a look at what happened.

    1. the ball comes over
    2. A Korean player heads it forwards into the mix and the eventual scorer is stood offside
    3. the ball lands at Kroos's feet and he attempts to clear but only manages to toepoke it to the player whose is stood in an offside position.
    4. the Korean player scores.

    IMO that is one phase of play and therefore the player was offside and the goal should not have stood.

    Having said that, I am so very glad it did as I have now seen a Group stage end with Germany bottom. It's never happened before and will very likely not happen again in the next 100 years.

    The image below is taken from the FIFA Offside Law description and is why I think the goal should not have stood. I look forward to your various perspectives on it.


    Not all that often I disagree with you 'Ammy but when Kroos toe poked the ball the Korean player moved forward anticipating an interception the ball then caught the legs of a second German player (I don't know who) so although he was in an offside position when he received the ball he wasn't when Kroos first hit it, The second touch from a German player played him onside.

    Don't forget the referee saw what you did and at first disallowed the goal until VAR showed him that second touch, that's when he changed his decision.
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    bramhallram

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by bramhallram on Thu 28 Jun 2018, 10:48 am

    Obviously some room for debate there. However, speaking as someone who had to endure two fat Germans going mental in a restaurant in Corsica when they nicked their late, late winner last week I'd just like to say...

    celebration celebration celebration

    .
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    MadAmster

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by MadAmster on Thu 28 Jun 2018, 11:19 am

    Sawls, I thought Kroos toepoked it through the 2nd player's legs without touching them (with the ball of course) hence my disallow thoughts.
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    SawleyRam

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by SawleyRam on Thu 28 Jun 2018, 11:38 am

    MadAmster wrote:Sawls, I thought Kroos toepoked it through the 2nd player's legs without touching them (with the ball of course) hence my disallow thoughts.

    The ball brushed both of the player's legs as it went though them (only slightly but it did happen) this is what VAR pointed out, difficult for the ref and assistant to spot admittedly but that is what VAR is for. A very easy situation to be mistaken. Without VAR it would have been disallowed.
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    New England Ram
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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by New England Ram on Wed 04 Jul 2018, 12:11 am

    All those years of heartache and no reaction to tonight’s drama on here.
    Unbelievable to actually be on the other end of things.
    Those cheating bastards should not have had an extra 5 minutes extra time to score their goal.
    Should have taken ten minutes off the time for all their fekin around.
    Ali and Sterling still done nothing going forward for me.
    Well done though..not pretty but they were never going to allow for that.



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    Jackal

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by Jackal on Wed 04 Jul 2018, 1:10 am

    New England Ram wrote:All those years of heartache and no reaction to tonight’s drama on here.
    Unbelievable to actually be on the other end of things.
    Those cheating bastards should not have had an extra 5 minutes extra time to score their goal.
    Should have taken ten minutes off the time for all their fekin around.
    Ali and Sterling still done nothing going forward for me.
    Well done though..not pretty but they were never going to allow for that.
    I think things will pick up on here when an incoming signing is announced. As for Colombia v England - well, they tried their dirty tricks but we stood tall against it, got a penalty and then held our nerve in a shootout. So all-in-all i think justice prevailed for once.
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    Stockport Ram

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by Stockport Ram on Wed 04 Jul 2018, 2:19 am

    Pretty much like a boxer who had a clear plan. and got caught by a knockout punch.

    Managed to stagger to his feet, took 15 minutes to recover in extra time, and dominated again...... and found the killer blow.

    I really can't fault what Gareth Southgate has produced with a limited squad but a clear plan, and a world class goal scorer.

    It has won World Cups before (74, 78, 86).
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    MadAmster

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by MadAmster on Wed 04 Jul 2018, 9:12 am

    To an extent I was impressed by the ref last night. He remained calm under extreme pressure from the Columbians. Why it actually took just over 4 minutes to take a free kick at one point, OK you can take a minute and a half off that for VAR, and well over 3 minutes between the body slam on Kane and his actually being able to take the spot kick was 100% down to the Columbians doing thier very best to rattle the England players and thereby causing them to take a poor kick. Why he allowed such blatant psychological nonsense to carry on as long as it did is a mystery.

    This is, IMO, down to a very bad, recent change in the Laws of the game. Players used to have to "retire immediately" the 10 yards (9m 15cm) distance. That has been removed from the Free kick Law. That allows this stupidity to occur. A player can noe only get penalised and cautioned if he is "actively preventing the taking of the free kick". That change was asking for trouble and it has got it........... in spades.

    I really admired the way our lads, almost always, didn't get sucked into the affray. Something the oppo were up to all night, hoping to get an England player a card. That really winds me up.



    IMO the South Americans have taken this form of cheating to a new level. It needs stamping out. Last nnight was a coming together of 2 diametrically opposed football cultures. It is good for the game that the right one won.

    Whoever wins this competition, and I hope it is England, I will be ecstatic if it is not a South American country. I want, so very much, for France to beat Uruguay and Belgium to beat Brazil. This is very unusual for me as I normally want the French to lose. I quote something often attributed to the eminent Oxford historian Richard Cobb: "Wonderful country France . . . pity about the French."

    The SA level of cheating at this World Cup has to be seen to be believed. Head butts, diving, feigning injury, elbows.......... and then the constant haranguing of the ref to force him to change his mind or, at least, go and watch a bit of telly..... almost always with the intention of harming an opponent's concentration and a 1% chance of getting a decision overturned. I may look at a replay of last night's affair to see just how much actual playing time there was. I think we would struggle to get 40 minutes...........
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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by New England Ram on Wed 04 Jul 2018, 10:32 am

    I thought he was poor Ammy..kept calm but he was half asleep.
    He let them take it too far and drag it out too long for my liking.
    I honestly think we could have and should have done a better job of staying out of the fray.
    Time and time again they surrounded the ref and a player or two of ours would insert themselves into that fray when they should all have been about twenty yards away watching them implode.



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    SawleyRam

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by SawleyRam on Wed 04 Jul 2018, 11:12 am

    Whilst the referee remained calm during the match he allowed intimidation of himself and opponents go unchecked allowing the intimidation to carry on destroying any resemblance of a football match. For too long when laws of football and even sometimes common laws on violence are ignored it becomes more prevalent, that's what happened last night.

    How the hell did a deliberate connecting headbutt (albeit a well disguised one) become a yellow card offence? The referee by giving the card admitted he had either saw it or had advice from someone in his ear and did not watch it on VAR to verify it, poor standards from the man in the middle. Intimidation worked on him alright.

    Failure of the other match officials to assist when the referee was surrounded after giving a deserved penalty and not even notice a player deliberately (to no avail) scuff up the penalty spot. Where was the help from VAR? Would they have come back to it if the penalty was missed? I doubt it.

    Half time as the players left the field even intimidation from Columbian official barging into Sterling then complaining to one of the match officials that Sterling did it to him.

    A poor and frightened interpretation of all football laws by intimidated and frighted officials.

    The result was the right one but what would impress me more is if FIFA took retrospective action against the cynical actions that were obviously planned beforehand. I won't hold my breath.

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    MadAmster

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    Re: World Cup Watch

    Post by MadAmster on Wed 04 Jul 2018, 1:57 pm

    New England Ram wrote:I thought he was poor Ammy

    Sawley Ram wrote:Whilst the referee remained calm during the match he allowed intimidation of himself and opponents go unchecked allowing the intimidation to carry on destroying any resemblance of a football match.

    Gentlemen, I did write
    MadAmster wrote:To an extent

    The head butt was ridiculous, the Colombians just had too much going on for even the best of refs to handle. FIFA really should get their shit together and take retrospective action against several of their players and that coach who had a go at Sterling at half time............

    They also need to instruct Friday's refs to accept absolutely no shit from Suarez et al and Neymar & Co. They are not as bad as the Colombian collective but they are cut from the same cloth.

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    Re: World Cup Watch

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